-- Ultratraditionalism
Pax Christi,
phatcatholic
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phatcatholic |
Articles on Ultratraditionalism |
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For a collection of articles in response to ultratraditionalism, see the following entry from the Defense Directory:
-- Ultratraditionalism Pax Christi, phatcatholic |
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galantarie |
Re: Reference Section: Ultratraditionalism | #1 | ||
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Lefebvre Successor Reportedly to Meet Pope
According to Society of St. Pius X ROME, AUG. 24, 2005 (Zenit.org).- The Society of St. Pius X said that Benedict XVI will receive its superior general, Bishop Bernard Fellay, in audience next Monday at the papal summer residence of Castel Gandolfo. The communiqu, issued today from the society's headquarters in Menzingen, Switzerland, added that "no public statement will be made before the audience." The meeting between the Pope and Bishop Fellay was meant to be discreet, but was made public in a letter by one of the society's four bishops, Richard Williamson, who is opposed to any "compromise" with the Holy See. The Holy See has yet to confirm this audience, but it has not denied the information published by the society, founded by French Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre. Pope John Paul II stated in an 1988 apostolic letter, "Ecclesia Dei," that the "illegitimate" ordination of four bishops within the society by Archbishop Lefebvre constituted "a schismatic act." The ordination cut short the attempt at an agreement between the Holy See and the society, carried out on behalf of John Paul II by Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, then prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith and now Benedict XVI. 2 requests The bishops ordained by Archbishop Lefebvre were Swiss Bernard Fellay, Frenchman Bernard Tissier de Mallerais, Briton Richard Williamson and Argentine Alfonso de Galarreta. Archbishop Lefebvre died in 1991 and was succeeded in the leadership of the society by Bishop Fellay. In a recent interview with DICI, the press agency of the motherhouse of the Society of St. Pius X, Bishop Fellay announced that, if he were to meet with Benedict XVI, he would request two things. First is the possibility for all priests to celebrate the Tridentine Mass without special permission from the local bishop, as is now required. Second is the "recanting [of] the decree of excommunication related to the consecrations" of the four bishops. |
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LQuidFire |
Re: Reference Section: Ultratraditionalism | #2 | ||
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Source: news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world...195680.stm
Vatican moves to end Church rift Pope Benedict has met the head of an ultra-conservative Catholic group expelled by the Church 17 years ago. The Pope and Bishop Bernard Fellay, leader of the Society of Saint Pius X, have agreed to try to end the rift. It was his consecration as bishop with three others in 1988, without Rome's permission, which led the fraternity being condemned as schismatic. The society has criticised the Vatican for becoming too liberal and continues to celebrate Mass in Latin. Excommunicated Pope Benedict and Bishop Fellay reached the agreement after meeting at the Pope's summer residence, Castel Gandolfo, south of Rome. Vatican spokesman Joaquin Navarro Vals said both men spoke of "their common will to proceed in stages and within reasonable delays" to achieve the return of the society into the Catholic fold. The Society of Saint Pius X was set up in opposition to liberalising changes introduced by the Second Vatican Council in the 1960s, which included allowing Mass to be celebrated in local languages, instead of Latin. Its founder, Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre, was excommunicated in 1988 by Pope John Paul II for consecrating the four bishops without Rome's permission. Bishop Fellay succeeded Archbishop Lefebvre, who died in 1991, as superior general of the fraternity based in Econe, Switzerland. He said Benedict's election to succeed John Paul II had brought about a "glimmer of hope" to find a way out of the "profound crisis" inside the Catholic Church. The new pope, who has promised to reach out to Christians separated from Rome, is known to be sympathetic to those Catholics who regret the abandoning of the Latin Mass four decades ago, says the BBC's David Willey in Rome. |
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galantarie |
Re: Reference Section: Ultratraditionalism | #3 | ||
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Now this is truly good news, is it not!
All except one of their leaders, Richard Williamson" and his followers like Fr. Grner, Gabriel Garnica, Michael A. Hoffmann II, and Marian Horvat, etc. are NOT. [They have outright said their goal is the downfall of the Church of Rome. They refuse all negotiations with Rome/ or Pope Benedict XVI.] Well, sorry for them. It looks like the others are smartening-up; and are looking for peace, reconcilliation and and a recindation of their excommunication! Papa just might bring them back home, and the rest can call themselves for what they truly are...PROTESTANTS! See their Hate site: www.revisionisthistory.org/christian.htm Again, thanks for this posting "LQuidFire"...and it is good to have you onboard. We needed a voice like yours here. All my very best; and continue to speak-out in favor of Our Papa and Christ. You have my support and love. May Our Papa's radiant-light continuously shine forth to illuminate Christ for the world!
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LQuidFire |
Re: Reference Section: Ultratraditionalism | #4 | ||
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Thanks a lot for your sweet remarks, galantarie! You're making me blush! :$
I am very happy, too, that so short after his election to Pope our Papa Benedictus XVI th has started official conversations with the FSSPX! It shows us, I think, how much our Papa wants to have one Church and one flok! This, of course, can only be found if everyone's united in our Lord Jesus Christ, if we all have the one Shepherd! Let us all pray that the converstaions between both parties help both, Rome and the FSSPX, to grow more and more towards God, through what they will be able to find a solution for the current situation they're in! And let us not judge others, but pray for all of us who wander in darkness and confusion! |
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galantarie |
Re: Reference Section: Ultratraditionalism | #5 | ||
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Here is wisdom from a Blogger:
Pope Meets With Head of Lefebvre Movement Posted by Dominick to Theophane On Religion 08/29/2005 9:31:40 AM PDT 10 of 119 I think that ultimately that it is likely the SSPX will have to come back into regular status with Rome without Bp Williamson, who seems determined to continue in exile forever DING! You win! I think there are a lot of die hards, that wave the SSPX banner, but are actually sedes. Williamson is probably among them. I would like to see more Tridentine Rite Masses, and I think there would have been a quicker resolution of the problems of the SSPX if Fellay had plowed on without Williamson. I think not requiring a repudiation of previous errors can be ignored, if the SSPX leadership can assent to the way things are now. The issue of universal Indult has not been settled, but it soon may be. May Our Papa's radiant-light continuously shine forth to illuminate Christ for the world!
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LQuidFire |
Re: Reference Section: Ultratraditionalism | #6 | ||
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Bah, what an evil post.
Well, what can I say. I live in Europe and since Msgr. Williamson isn't here very often, I don't know his vision on things. What I know, though, is that the status of the FSSPX wouldn't have been different from now if Msgr. Williamson wasn't with FSSPX anymore. The reasons for why they stand where they stand are not that Msgr. Williamson doesn't want to get along with Rome or any kind of that non-sense! |
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semperidem |
Re: Reference Section: Ultratraditionalism | #7 | ||
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If I may be forgiven for saying this, while there are issues which must be addressed to bring the Society home, there is so much mess to clean up in house that we must begin SOON cleaning our own house.
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galantarie |
Re: Reference Section: Ultratraditionalism | #8 | ||
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Sorry Chris:
Our Doors Must Remain Open! May Our Papa's radiant-light continuously shine forth to illuminate Christ for the world!
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Imladris |
Re: Reference Section: Ultratraditionalism | #9 | ||
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Don't know if this was ever read by anyone here at the time, but this piece popped up today in my Yahoo e-mail mailbox alert. It is a lengthy Los Angeles Times article about traditionalists from February of 2004, around the time "The Passion of the Christ" was about to be released in movie theatres:
An excerpt: Quote: Read the rest here: www.latimes.com/news/local/valley/la-tm-catholics07feb15,0,2607921.story?coll=la-editions-valley ~Imladris~
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galantarie |
Re: Reference Section: Ultratraditionalism | #10 | ||
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Since that article, most want to comeback to Rome!
Coming Home to Rome ---except for the heretical Williamson's followers. It is the Ultra-trads we have to worry about: see: p072.ezboard.com/ftheratzingerforumfrm26.showMessage?topicID=19.topic "The Priestly Fraternity of St. Peter", and "Juventutem", though traditionalist, obeys the Papacy, and is in full communion with Rome: p072.ezboard.com/ftheratzingerforumfrm26.showMessage?topicID=18.topic Our Papa is speculating whether to open the Universal Indult, and create for Traditionalists a "special Holy Ordre" with rles after the Brazilian* and French Monastic successful models, where they always perform the Tridentine Rite, and totally submit to the Rome Papacy and Magisterium. [Even as Cardinal Ratzinger, Papa celebrated the Tridentine rite with them many times.] As, I stated before, the only trouble is coming from Richard Williamson's following: Michael Hoffmann II, "Fr." Grner, Marian Horvat, Gabriel Garnica, Atila S.Guimares,Michael J. Matt, John Vennari, etc. and their newspaper, "The Remnant" ! "Bishop" Williamson and his trad-rad following, have proven themselves to be really Protestants and hell-raisers.... See the postings at: Papal apartment and trad-rad against Stampa ________________________________________________ * I want to restate the Perl quote here concerning Campos, Brazil, as a "possible model" to be followed in the future.: "The diocese of Campos, which lies in a sugar plantation region in northeastern Brazil, is a unique place. It was headed in the early post-conciliar period by Bishop Antonio de Castro Mayer (bishop of Campos from 1949 to 1981). Castro Mayer, a very traditional bishop who opposed some of the documents of Vatican II, never implemented the conciliar liturgical reforms in his Brazilian diocese. When the Vatican forced him to retire in 1981, the traditional Latin Mass was still being celebrated by virtually every priest in every church in Campos. Even after his resignation, throughout the 1980s, Castro Mayer continued to be the leader of the traditional Catholics in Campos, who were a vast majority in the diocese, because they had never known any other liturgy. Though this caused tensions with the new bishop, there was no official schism. Then, in 1988, Castro Mayer officiated along with Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre at Lefebvre's consecration in Econe, Switzerland, of four bishops to lead the Society of St. Pius X, despite the Pope's specific order not to do so. This led the Holy See to declare Lefebvre, Castro Mayer and the four new bishops excommunicated. The 'Lefebvrist Schism' was born. Castro Mayer died in April, 1991. The traditional Catholics in Campos -- again, the vast majority of all the Catholics in the diocese -- were now being led by Bishop Liciano Rangel, who was ordainned in 1991 by three of the four excommunicated bishops of the St. Pius X Society. So in Campos, there was a traditional Catholic community far more numerically predominant than in any other diocese in the world -- and it was in schism. After more than a decade of separation from Rome, Bishop Rangel on January 18, 2002, made his peace with Rome, and Rome with him. The Holy See appointed Rangel 'Apostolic Administrator of St. John Maria Vianney' -- a type of notional diocese within the territory of the Campos diocese, which continued to have its own bishop.> This solution emerged after Rangel made independent overtures to Rome, to the disappointment of many in the larger St. Pius X movement. Rangel's apostolic administration thus became the world's first Tridentine-rite Mass community headed by a legitimate bishop recognized by Rome. Thus, by this decision, Rome brought back into communion a schismatic group of traditionalists -- and at the same time publicly accepted the old rite as a fully legitimate rite within Roman Catholicism." "I have a mustard- seed; and I am not afraid to use it."
[Ratzinger:"Salt of the Earth"] May Our Papa's radiant-light continuously shine forth to illuminate Christ for the world! |
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Imladris |
Re: Reference Section: Ultratraditionalism | #11 | ||
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Thanks Galantarie for your links. It does look though like this piece is really talking about the ultras and calling them trads, by the way it describes them, to quote:
Quote: Perhaps the author is not bothering to make any distinction between the two and lumping them together. Is that paper considered "liberal"? ~Imladris~
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galantarie |
Re: Reference Section: Ultratraditionalism | #12 | ||
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I would say more misinformed than anything else....
Take another look at the links I posted above. I also have somewhere a story about Our Papa's commitment to Fontgomault and Weimar, and the free restoration of the Tridentine Mass.... ![]() ![]() ![]() and from 1999 in Weimar's Church of the Heart of Jesus on Saturday 17 April.The pontifical Mass of Cardinal Ratzinger: ![]() ![]() At the Seminarian Meeting at Weimar's "Heart of Jesus Church", on 17 April 1999, restating his Roman intercession of 24 OCT. 1988, Cardinal Ratzinger once again spoke of his hopes: Regular Sunday Masses according to the 1962 Missal are somewhat rare in Germany due to the hostility of the majority of the bishops. Such celebrations still do not take place in the vast majority of parishes in the English-speaking world, but during the early-morning drive to Recklinghausen I witnessed a sight that should encourage us never to abandon hope. Weimar is in the former Russian zone of Germany and during the journey to Recklinghausen we passed through the site of the former barrier between East and West. The watchtowers and fences which marked the boundary between tyranny and freedom have been allowed to remain in place as a reminder of what once had been, and which most of those imprisoned behind it had feared would always be. Even in dioceses with the most intransigent bishops the traditional Catholics should never abandon hope. With prayer anything is possible. ...We must pray above all for what Cardinal Ratzinger told us to hope for in his 24 October 1988 lecture in Rome: a new generation of bishops who will no longer oppose the celebration of the Mass of our Fathers which formed the heart of the Faith of our Fathers. "I have a mustard- seed; and I am not afraid to use it."
[Ratzinger:"Salt of the Earth"] May Our Papa's radiant-light continuously shine forth to illuminate Christ for the world! |
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phatcatholic |
Re: Reference Section: Ultratraditionalism | #13 | ||
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I updated the original post with the new link.
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